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Again on Isaiah 53 and about the use of the Word Zara(Seed)

Isaiah 53:10 talks of a servant who will “see seed”:

“Yet it was the LORD’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,and though the LORD makes his life a guilt offering, he will see seed ( zara is Hebrew for seed) and prolong his days,and the will of the LORD will prosper in his hand. ”

It is the only time in the entire OT that this phrase appears.Today many say it 100% means biological descent and so it can NOT be about Jesus,who never had children.

I showed in another article that Jewish interpretation of Isaiah 53 said it was about Jeremiah(in the Talmud) and Rabbi Menahem Schneerson (head of the Lubavitcher Jews,a very Orthodox Jewish group,originally from Eastern Europe).

So?

But Jeremiah and Rabbi Schneerson had NO biological descendants.I had written about aspects of Isaiah 53 before,so the whole series is:

A) “Is Isaiah 53 about Jesus or about the Jewish PEOPLE?”

http://www.avraidire.com/2010/05/is-isaiah-53-about-jesus-or-about-the-jewish-people/

B) “More on Isaiah 53 and if it applies to Jesus”

http://www.avraidire.com/2010/06/more-on-isaiah-53-and-if-it-applies-to-jesus/

C) “About the Muslim Argument that Isaiah 9 and Isaiah 53 are NOT about Jesus because they are in the Past Tense”

http://www.antisharia.com/2010/06/14/about-the-muslim-argument-that-isaiah-9-and-53-are-not-about-jesus-because-they-are-in-the-past-tense/

THE WORD ZARA IN THE OT IS ALSO USED IN A METAPHORICAL(not BIOLOGICAL) SENSE:

We have three cases,and guess what,they are all from Isaiah.They refer to the Jewish PEOPLE as a seed.Here I give the literal words used,from Young’s Literal Translation:

Case 1:

Isaiah 1:4:

“Ah, sinning nation, a people heavy [with] iniquity, a seed of evildoers, sons — corrupters! They have forsaken Jehovah, They have despised the Holy One of Israel, They have gone away backward.”

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=isaiah%201:4&version=YLT

Case 2:

Isaiah 14:20:

“Thou art not united with them in burial, For thy land thou hast destroyed, Thy people thou hast slain, Not named to the age is the seed of evildoers.”

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=isaiah%2014:20&version=YLT

Case 3

Isaiah 57:4:

“Against whom do ye sport yourselves? Against whom enlarge ye the mouth? Prolong ye the tongue? Are not ye children of transgression? a false seed(also translated as seed of falsehood)?”

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=isaiah%2057:4&version=YLT

Conclusion

The word zara is used in a metaphorical sense so the seed in Isaiah 53 can just as well refer to a non-biological descendant,a SPIRITUAL one,a disciple,follower.

Two Interesting Debates

1)David Wood vs Bassam Zawadi

“Does the Evidence show that Islam is True?”,1st segment of the debate in youtube

2)David Wood vs Bassam

“Does the Evience show Christianity is True?”,1st segment of the debate in youtube

 

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Muslim or Muhammadan?

S.3:52. When Jesus found
Unbelief on their part
He said: “Who will be
My helpers to (the work
Of) God?” Said the Disciples:
“We are God’s helpers:
We believe in God,
And do thou bear witness
That we are Muslims.

According to the above ayah, believers in Allah before the time / existence of Muhammad were already “Muslim!” How then does Islam say to become a Muslim ‘one must believe in Allah and his messenger?’ Even the pagan Arabs believed in Allah and were still persecuted nonetheless!

Are the millions who claim to be “Muslims” actually not Muslims at all in the Quranic sense, but followers and worshipers of Muhammad? Are they “monotheist” in the sense that they really worship no one else other than Muhammad? Or does Islam commit the very sin it condemns others for “Shirk?”

This is a question to ponder on, for if one lays their emotions aside and looks at what the Quran teaches on this, the answer may be quite shocking to the serious inquirer!

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What the "Koran for Dummies"(when written by a Muslim)will not tell Non-Muslims

This is for QUICK REFERENCE for the readers.They can copy it and show it to non-Muslims so THEY can form an opinion based on facts.

1.ALLAH PRAYS IN THE KORAN(not in “The Koran for Dummies”):

Allah in the Koran PRAYS upon Mohammed(sura 33:43/33:56).LITERAL word used in Arabic,”pray”.How can a Deity pray?To who?Muslims say it means “to bless”,yet the Arabic word doesn’t mean bless but pray.

2.HE WHO KILLS FOR ALLAH(like Ben Laden)GOES TO HEAVEN

Sura 9:111 says he who KILLS or is KILLED fighting for Allah goes to HEAVEN.It says he who kills,not only he who is killed.Read it,exact words.

3.JEWS ARE CURSED BY ALLAH(declared EVIL)TILL DAY OF RESURRECTION

It says Allah has “established ENMITY and HATRED among them(the Jews) till the DAY of RESURRECTION.”It is saying “Jews are evil and Allah made it so”,Judeophobia.Read it,I am not inventing it:sura 5:64.

GOOD THING IN THE KORAN BUT….THERE ARE CONDITIONS

1.FREE SLAVES BUT…ONLY IF YOU THINK THEY ARE WORTHY OF IT

Koran says to FREE slaves but it is CONDITIONAL,only if the master thinks they are WORTH IT,good enough.Read it:sura 24:33.It is NOT:”All have the right to freedom,it is SOME can be free,others not.”

BE KIND,HAVE LOVE AND MERCY FOR WOMEN BUT….

Treat women WELL:
a.sura 30:21:Allah has put “LOVE and MERCY”between man and woman
b.sura 4:19:”treat women with KINDNESS”

But it is CONDITIONAL:
Sura 2:223:the wife is a TILTH/FIELD of the husband and he can go to the FIELD(her) WHENEVER he wants.

TEXT:
2:223:”Your women are your TILTH/FIELD and you go to your TILTH/FIELD as you like.”

No consent asked.A FIELD is your PROPERTY,so she is like his property,you can do with your property as you wish.
4:19 says to”treat women with KINDNESS”,also CONDITIONAL since in the SAME chapter,a few verses later,it says the husband can BEAT her(4:34).

SLAVES FOR SEX ALLOWED(even if you are MARRIED)

It is in 23:5-6/70:29-30 where she “who your right hand possesses” is universally understood as meaning “your slave.”Nobody doubts it.

Now if the WIFE can be treated like PROPERTY,and CANNOT refuse her husband,then the SLAVE GIRL,who really is PROPERTY can NOT either,she can NOT have more rights than the wife.

VERIFY WITH 10 TRANSLATIONS

I recently found this website with TEN Koran translations(6 by Muslims,4 by non-Muslims,plus the ARABIC text in LATIN letters).
The way to find a sura there is like this:
1.First,in the BLANK SPACE on TOP write “sura 2:223”,for example.
2.Then CHOOSE which of the 10 translators(better all)and if you want choose the Arabic text also,and then press SUBMIT(in the UPPER part,under the blank space )and it will give you the verse.

http://www.quranbrowser.com/

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More on Sura 65:4 and Pre-Puberty Wives

I began on this in:
http://www.avraidire.eu/2010/04/is-the-koran-in-favor-of-having-pre-puberty-wives/

SURA 65:4:
“And for those of your women who have despaired of menstruation, if you have a doubt, their prescribed time will be three months, and of those too who have NOT had their courses; and for the pregnant women, their prescribed time is till they give birth.”

NO WAITING PERIOD IF NO SEXUAL RELATIONS BEFORE A DIVORCE

How do we know 65:4 refers to 3 MONTHS to see if she is PREGNANT?Because in SURA 33:49 it says to divorce a woman you have NOT TOUCHED(no sexual relations) you do NOT have to wait anything.

SURA 33:49:
“Oh you who believe! If you wed believing women and DIVORCE them BEFORE you have TOUCHED THEM, then there is NO waiting period. But content them and release them handsomely.”
http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/quran/033.qmt.html

ANALYSIS
Taking “those who have NOT had menstruation” as pre-puberty wives then since they have to wait (divorce not immediate like in 33:49)it means there was a sexual relation.

KRISTINALOVESJESUS AND HER VIDEO ON THE SYNOPTICS WRITTEN BEFORE 70 AD
I had argued in favor of it before.She is a 20 year old girl who has important things to say:

INTERNAL EVIDENCE IN FAVOR:
1.LUKE-ACTS ends in 61 AD with PAUL still alive.In ACTS 21/then 27-28 the author begins saying WE and US:he becomes Paul’s companion.
2.The consensus(at least 95% agreement) of scholars is LUKE-ACTS/ MATT came 10 years AFTER MARK.
3.That puts MARK at 51 AD.
4.The Synoptics(Matt,Luke,Mark) all have a NOT NAMED man cutting an ear the night Jesus was arrested(Matt 26:51/Mark 14:47/Luke 22:50).Later JOHN(90 AD) tells us it was SIMON PETER(John 18:10).Why?To not get PETER,one of the 3 top church leaders(with PAUL and JAMES),into trouble.In 61 AD he was STILL alive(killed by Emperor NERO in 64 AD).
5.The technical reason scholars put MARK at 70 AD at EARLIEST is because prophecies are impossible and they have Jesus prophesizing the destruction of the TEMLE(Mark 13:1-2/Matt 24:1-2/Luke 21:56)and JERUSALEM(Luke 13:33-35/Luke 19:41-44/Matt 23:37-39).

MISSING HISTORY
If ACTS is from 80-85 AD(it’s a history of church AFTER Jesus)then WHY omit:
1.Death of JAMES,head of Jerusalem church)in 62 AD.To show he was sincere.
2.Death of PETER and PAUL in 64 AD.To prove they weren’t charlatans.
3.Mention of fulfillment of Jesus’ prophecy(Temple-Jerusalem).To show he was a real prophet.
Why omit 20-25 years?No real answer.

HER VIDEO “All NT Books written Prior to 100 AD”:
She makes a comparison:she gives modern PARALLELS using PEARL HARBOR and the WORLD TRADE CENTER(people writing histories of it and not mentioning them):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qR_f_veY11k

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How a Scientific Miracle in the Koran is Disproved by the Koran

Sura 21:33 says:

“And He it is Who created the NIGHT and the DAY, and the SUN and the MOON. They float, EACH in an ORBIT.”

http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/quran/021.qmt.html

The Impression

First the MOON has an ORBIT around the earth,and THEN (before COPERNICUS)people believed the SUN went in ORBIT around the earth.That’s why it has DAY/SUN and NIGHT/MOON.

Scientific Information

1.Our solar system is made up of the SUN(a STAR)with planets that go in orbit around it.

2.It is one of HUNDREDS of BILLIONS of STARS in our GALAXY.

3.The UNIVERSE is made up of HUNDREDS of BILLIONS of GALAXIES.

Muslims say the ORBIT of the SUN means:when every more than 100 MILLION years the sun makes an ORBIT around the center of the GALAXY.It is true,the sun is orbiting the galaxy.For them that’s what 21:33 refers to.If so then there is a CONTRADICTION in the Koran.

Why?

Because 18:86 says clearly the SUN sets in a MUDDY SPRING.Then it can NOT be orbiting the galaxy if it is there at NIGHT.Or maybe it is in the spring at night,and during the DAY it orbits the galaxy(not scientific).

Sura 18:86:

“Till, when he REACHED the SETTING-PLACE of the SUN, he FOUND it SETTING in a MUDDY SPRING, and found a people thereabout. We said: O Dhu’l-Qarneyn! Either punish or show them kindness.”

http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/quran/018.qmt.html

 

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Allah in the Koran is not All-Knowing

In 625 AD was the battle of UHUD,near Mecca,where 3,000 Meccans defeatd 1,000 Muslims.The Muslims were in shock.Allah says he let them be defeated so he COULD KNOW who was a real believer,who wasn’t.

Sura 3:140:

“If you have received a blow, the (disbelieving) people have received a blow the like thereof. These are the vicissitudes which We cause to follow one another for mankind, to the END that ALLAH MAY KNOW those WHO BELIEVE and MAY CHOOSE WITNESSES from AMONG YOU; and Allah loves not wrong-doers.”

Mecca today

Mecca today

English translations

The 3 Muslims(PICKTHAL(British convert)/SHAKIR/YUSUFALI) all say “MAY KNOW” in regard to Allah:
http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/quran/003.qmt.html

SPANISH TRANSLATION(by Muslims)

It is written:

“para que(so that/in order to) Allah DISTINGA (verb “differentiate”)QUIENES (who) son los que creen(verb”to believe”).”

http://www.nurelislam.com/coran/index.htm

FRENCH TRANSLATION(by Muslims)

It has:

“AFIN(so that/in order to) que DIEU RECONNAISSE CEUX(God SHOULD RECONIZE those) qui ONT CRU(have believed).”

http://oumma.com/coran/afficher.php?NumSourate=3

Giving due credit

The info comes from NAKDIMON,who participates in answeringmuslims.com.I found the information in one of his youtube videos(rebuttals to SAMI ZAATARI,a Muslim).It is in minute 1:45 of his video.He is Jewish and also a believer in Jesus:

Here is the beginning of his rebuttal of SAMI ZAATARI:

ANOTHER JEWISH BELIEVER IN JESUS

JOEL ROSENBERG identifies with the Jewish people.His father is Jewish(and also a Jesus believer),his mother non-Jewish.His father’s parents were Orthodox Jews.His has written 2 GREAT BOOKS:

1.The novel THE EZEKIEL OPTION:

Iran with the help of GOG(Russian dictator) tries to destroy Israel.It has a great love story in it also,plus an ex-director of Mosad who had become a believer in Jesus.

http://www.amazon.com/Ezekiel-Option-Political-Thrillers/dp/1414303440/ref=pd_sim_b_7

2.The non-fiction book INSIDE THE REVOLUTION:HOW THE FOLLOWERS OF JIHAD,JEFFERSON AND JESUS ARE BATTLING TO DOMINATE THE MIDDLE EAST AND TRANSFORM IT (it has about how many Muslims are becoming Christian,with 1 MILLION having done so in IRAN):

http://www.amazon.com/Inside-Revolution-Followers-Jefferson-Transform/dp/1414319312/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272231868&sr=1-1

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Slavery,the Koran and the Bible

The Koran says to free slaves but it is CONDITIONAL:
SURA 24:33:
“Let those who find not the wherewithal for marriage keep themselves chaste, until Allah gives them means out of His grace. And if any of your SLAVES ask for a deed in writing (to enable them to earn their freedom for a certain sum), give them such a deed if you know ANY GOOD in them: give them something yourselves out of the means which Allah has given to you. But force not your maids to prostitution when they desire chastity, in order that you may make a gain in the goods of this life. But if anyone compels them, yet, after such compulsion, is Allah, Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.”
http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/engagement/resources/texts/muslim/quran/024.qmt.html

ANALYSIS
It is not the same thing as saying:”ALL have the RIGHT to FREEDOM.”It says:”Freedom is if they are worthy of it.”

FREEDOM OF SLAVES IN MOSAIC LAW

1.EVERY SLAVE THAT ESCAPES IS FREE(LITERAL words used)

DEUT 23:15-16:
“You will NOT give back to his master the SLAVE who has ESCAPED from his master to you.He may dwell with you in your midst, in the place which he chooses within one of your gates, where it seems best to him; you will not OPPRESS him.”

2.EVERY 50 YEARS ALL SLAVES WILL BE FREED(literal words used)

LEVITICUS 25:10:
“And you will consecrate the FIFTIETH YEAR, and proclaim LIBERTY throughout all the LAND to ALL its INHABITANTS. It will be a Jubilee for you; and each of you will return to his possession, and each of you shall return to his family.”

IN THE NT

PAUL says in 1 COR 7:20-21:
“Let each one remain in the same calling in which he was called.Were you called while a SLAVE? Do not be concerned about it; but if you can BECOME FREE,do it.”

ANALYSIS
PAUL says to THE SLAVE that he can get freedom BY HIMELF.In the Koran it is with the permission of the master.

WHY?
Because in the Antiquite there was alot of injustice.MANY became slaves due to KIDNAPPING.

EXAMPLE:JULIUS CEASAR

He was captured by PIRATES when a young man.An enormous amount was asked for his freedom.If he had not got it then Julius Ceaser would have been SOLD as a SLAVE by the pirates.In spite of it,when Ceaser conquered Gaul(France) he SOLD 1 MILLION of its inhabitants as slaves.

JESUS SAYS HE IS THE SLAVE OF ALL

MARK 10:43-45:
“Yet it will not be so among you; but whoever desires to become great among you shall be your servant.And whoever of you desires to be FIRST will be SLAVE of ALL.For even the SON OF MAN did NOT come to be served, BUT TO SERVE, and to give His life a ransom for many.”

THE GOLDEN RULE AND HEBREWS

HEBREUX 13:3:
“Remember the PRISONER as if YOU were in PRISONER. And remember those who are TREATED BADLY as if you yourselves were suffering.”

SLAVES are also PRISONERS,they are not free.

CONDEMNATION OF SLAVE TRAFICKING

It is in REVELATION 18:10-13 and also in 1 TIMOTHY 1:8-10(Young’s Literal Translation):
“And we have known that the law is good, if any one may use it lawfully;
having known this, that for a righteous man law is not set, but for lawless and insubordinate persons, ungodly and sinners, impious and profane, parricides and matricides, men-slayers,whoremongers, sodomites, MEN-STEALERS, liars, perjured persons,and if there be any other thing that to sound doctrine is adverse.”
http://www.biblegateway.com/versions/

DEBATES,DEBATES,DEBATES!

For those who are hungry they can hear alot of debates between Christians(like WILLIAM CRAIG,MICHAEL LICONA,DINESH D’SOUZA.ALISTAIR MCGRATH,the astonishing GARY HABERMAS,etc) and non-Christians(DAN BARKER,HECTOR AVALOS,EHRMAN,etc) on alot of issues (Does God exist? Did Jesus Resurrect?etc)

http://bringyou.to/apologetics/audio.htm

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